Timeline for Welcher Fall soll in diesem Satz nach „als“ stehen?
Current License: CC BY-SA 4.0
8 events
| when toggle format | what | by | license | comment | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Jul 12, 2021 at 19:59 | comment | added | HalvarF | This has a lot time, no problem. I'm just saying that your only source so far has been your Sprachgefühl and you have shown nothing at all to support your argument. | |
| Jul 12, 2021 at 19:46 | comment | added | lidqy | I don't mind if you keep thinking your sense of correctly phrasing the subject of Italian language beauty is correct+the rabbit hole you've run into is the only true and correct rabbit hole ever ;). But it is just because I've read some dozens books of Hesse, Mann, Max Frisch, Thomas Bernhard, etc that I am convinced that the version I mentioned is right. I have to disappoint you nonetheless, I won't start reading these books again just to proof I am right. In case I will stumble accidently over an example concerning this subject by one of the authors, I'll add it to this conversation. Bye :) | |
| Jul 12, 2021 at 19:28 | comment | added | HalvarF | Well, you see, to me, "Im eher als schöner Sprache geltenden Italienisch" sounded dead wrong from the beginning and still does, and I think you've just gone deep down the wrong rabbit hole here. So as long as you don't show some Thomas Mann or Hesse or Kant or, really, any examples from credible sources, I will continue to just think you're completely mislead here. | |
| Jul 12, 2021 at 19:01 | comment | added | lidqy | Despite the fact your deductive explanations sound reasonable I'm still fully convinced the only correct+more over elaborate expression is "Im eher als schöner Sprache geltenden Italienisch". "Im eher als schöne Sprache geltenden Italienisch" sounds a little clumsy and funny, least to my ear. Same is true e.g. for "Er erkannte den als kreativer Syntaktiker sehr bekannten Professor" some prof claims to be good/correct German. Sounds like a horrible phonetic, grammerly accident. Should be "als kreativen Syntaktiker". The birth defect here is to squeeze language into rules it wasn't built from. | |
| Jul 12, 2021 at 18:07 | comment | added | HalvarF | So you're arguing that because of "im" it has to be Dativ, but it's a whole different thing with "trotz" and Genitiv? Why? I looked it up in Duden Grammatik in the meantime. Since "Italienisch gilt als schöne Sprache" uses the nominative, the participle phrase "als schöne Sprache geltend" also needs Nominativ after als, regardless of the case in the surrounding sentence, as explained in my answer. It's the same with "Der Onkel ist als Weihnachtsmann verkleidet" => "Trotz des als Weihnachtsmann verkleideten Onkels..." | |
| Jul 12, 2021 at 17:57 | comment | added | lidqy | Of course I would say as a native German '"Italienisch gilt als schöne Sprache' I would also say "Das als schöne Sprache geltende Italienisch", but due to the Im' introducing the whole expression, a Dativ construction is required, and without any article schön gets declined to schöner which is the Dativ femininum without any article. See Example with Katze, hiere: sprachekulturkommunikation.com/… Your example with 'Weihnachtsmannes' does not make sense because it is Genetiv. And schöner in the former example is Dativ. | |
| Jul 12, 2021 at 17:09 | comment | added | HalvarF | Could you explain why it should be Dativ in your opinion? To me that's incorrect because of the word "geltenden". Would you also say: "Italienisch gilt als schöner Sprache" (instead of "als schöne Sprache", Nominativ)? Or "Trotz eines als Weihnachtsmannes verkleideten Onkels ..." (instead of: "trotz eines als Weihnachtsmann verkleideten Onkels" (Nominativ))? I don't get your reasoning here. Also, this is grammar, nothing changed about this with Rechtschreibreform. | |
| Jul 12, 2021 at 15:36 | history | answered | lidqy | CC BY-SA 4.0 |