3

If I say:

Ich war dagagen, für dich zu stimmen als du mich angerufen hast, und mich doch überzeugt hast.

to express:

I was against voting for you when you called me and convinced me otherwise.

is that correct? Or must I say:

Ich war dagagen, für dich zu stimmen als du mich angerufen hast, und mich überzeugt hast, anders zu tun.

Are either or both of these correct? I want to figure out how I could express the "otherwise" part. I think that you can use "doch" in response to someone who assumes the negative, as one uses "nein" when someone assumes the positive. Is that right? When should I use "doch"?

  • und mich überzeugen hast is wrong grammar. The verb überzeugen isn't a modal, so haben takes Partizip II. – Janka Apr 30 at 5:22
  • Anders zu tun is nothing you would ever say. A normal sentence would be: Ich war gegen dich, aber mit deinem Anruf hast du mich überzeugt. – Christian Geiselmann Apr 30 at 12:21
1

Als denotes simultaneity and attaching it to the first sentence is confusing because I understand it to mean - I was against voting for you when you called. To be clearer, the als ... anrufen part should go with ... überzeugen.

Doch comes in to show an affirmation in contrast to the first sentence.

Ich war dagegen, für dich zu stimmen. Doch du hast mich überzeugt, als du angerufen hast.

  • "I was against voting for you when you called" is the exact same translation as intended in the question, so you need to clarify what is confusing you. – Annatar Apr 30 at 9:47
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For your example, both - anders or doch - are acceptable. You are also correct that doch is used for a positive turn after a negative question or intention. To turn positive into negative, nicht is used inside a sentence, nein is used alone or as start of an answer.

Ich wollte für Hugo stimmen, als du mich angerufen und überzeugt hast, es nicht zu tun.

Here I found it nicer to avoid using hast twice.

-1

I translate places where I would say doch with anyhow. Even simpler, you can use affirmative do-support. " The nuances are difficult, Das hast du doch begriffen (surely, without doubt). As your translation shows, there's no adverb necessary. I'm not sure what you are trying to say with the German.

The first sentence is a garden path sentence, als implies simultanity, not sequence of events. You might say before instead or construct something with dann (first, but then).

doch there implies they first didn't want to call you, but then did it anyway.

A dictionary will tell you about though. You know that though.

  • 1
    "Doch" is not the same as "anyhow" or "though" here. It contrasts "dagegen sein" und "überzeugen" - this has nothing to do with the calling part. "Als" is perfectly fine as long as the different parts of the sentence are nested correctly. – Annatar Apr 30 at 9:38
  • @Annatar I didn't say it was the same. It works anyhow. I was half asleep. "Du hast mich doch überzeugt" works, but "als du mich angerufen und doch überzeugt hast* is stylistically unsound because the subjects of the verbs that you see opposed aren't in agreement, so that doch does seem to contrast with a prior action of the closest subject. That confused me when I was half asleep and won't confuse a careful listener, who is willing to tolerate a broken syntax and infer meaning from context. I'm sure someone can draw a pretty syntax tree of the problem, I can't though. – vectory Apr 30 at 19:27
  • Sorry, I meant: I'm sure a syntax tree could be drawn by someone, though not by me. – vectory Apr 30 at 19:28
  • "als du mich angerufen und [doch] überzeugt hast" is short for ""als du mich angerufen hast und du mich [doch] überzeugt hast", so there's no problem with agreement. – Annatar May 2 at 5:55

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